Contribution
My Lords, I thank the Minister for her response—it was perhaps not unexpected. I also thank all those who spoke in this debate. I am really pleased that there is consensus on mandatory reporting, but perhaps the wording requires a little more work. I understand why His Majesty’s Government think that another vehicle might be more appropriate—perhaps this is a useful rehearsal for that future debate. I do not think what the Government are currently proposing goes far enough, but the Minister is absolutely right that we need to use every opportunity we can to discuss the protection of children.
I thank the noble Baroness, Lady Walmsley, for the decades of work that she has done in this area. She has had a couple of attempts at a Private Member’s Bill and I am following her footsteps.
The noble Baroness raised the absolutely abhorrent case of Jimmy Savile, who was given complete, unfettered access to vulnerable people based on the fundraising that he did. As a child, I spent lots of time at Stoke Mandeville and at other sports events in places where he turned up. I remember one event when I was probably about 12 years old. He arrived to a great fanfare and lots of people said, “Jimmy’s here, Jimmy’s here; you have to go and see him”. I was not particularly keen to do that. There was one adult who said to me, very quietly, “No, you don’t need to go”. I asked why—“Everyone is saying we have to go and see Jimmy”—and she said, “No, no; you can just stay here. You don’t need to go”. I did not think anything of it or tell anyone. I was chatting with my friends, and I thought she probably thought that chatting with my friends was more important than going to see him.
That was one adult who had a suspicion and was uncomfortable about behaviour, but there was nothing I could raise and nobody I could complain to. I was just told, “You don’t need to go near him”. It reminds me of how easy it is for adults in positions of power or trust to groom and to coax and to then lead to abuse, and how adults have an amazing position, where they can get into really uncomfortable situations. But adults also have incredibly positive relationships with children. I note the words of the noble Baroness, Lady Barran, and recognise her extensive work in volunteering. I do not want this amendment in any way to stop people volunteering or to make them feel that they are not able to or that there is undue pressure on them, but I wonder whether there is a form of words, or whether the right training and regulations could be put around it, that would enable people to feel more comfort. Again, a lot of youth organisations and other organisations have very positive relationships with young people.
I thank the noble Lord, Lord Moynihan. We have worked together for a long time on duty of care. I have to say that the idea for an ombudsman that was in my 2017 government report on duty of care was actually borrowed from him and the noble Baroness, Lady Hoey, from the early 1990s. I think we both agree that sport, at its best, is absolutely amazing. It can give people a very positive life. I have benefited hugely from my time in sport, but whether it is teachers or coaches, those who want to access children live on their reputation. I have heard a number of times, “But they are a good coach”, or, “They are good at their job”, and they are able to slip through the net.
I also pay tribute to the survivors of football abuse, who I have met several times over the years. A number of them came into Parliament about 18 months ago to talk about their experience and how it was just ignored by so many people around them because there was no legislation in place. Again, they fell victim to, “But they are a good coach”. Abusers were able to tie into these young boys’ dreams of wanting to play professional football. That leads me to the words of the noble Baroness, Lady Walmsley, and my noble friend Lady Finlay: we have to be better at defining what a healthy relationship is, and educate children at an appropriate age about that. In a sporting context, there is far more that we can do on the athlete pathway and as people graduate through to performance levels. My noble friends Lord Meston and Lord Bichard and my noble and learned friend Lady Butler-Sloss have extensive experience of these issues, very sadly, and we should listen to them.
Like my noble friend Lord Bichard, I argued against the watering down of DBS checks, because it would allow those who want access to children to be able to get it too easily. I am reassured by some of the statements made about sharing information between LADOs, but I do not think they go far enough.
I would support the amendments from the noble Lords, Lord Lucas and Lord Watson of Invergowrie, if they brought them back at another time. The IICSA report took seven years. I believe strongly that all its recommendations need to be implemented. It is not just about the intention of the recommendations; they should be implemented in full. With that in mind, I recognise that I probably need to do some more work on drafting and have further discussions on this amendment. At this time, I beg leave to withdraw.