Dan Tomlinson

I agree with the right hon. Gentleman on one point: the welfare system that we inherited was failing. Our Government need to correct the mistakes that meant welfare spending was running out of control, as it was when the shadow Chancellor, the right hon. Member for Central Devon (Sir Mel Stride), was Secretary of State for Work and Pensions. We must carefully consider the welfare system and make reforms that support people into work and ensure that the forecast budget increases are sustainable for the public finances. I agree with the right hon. Member for Gainsborough on that point. I have not heard the £12,000 statistic before, but I would caution against such statistics, which often appear in the press. Many welfare claimants up and down the country are pensioners who receive the state pension. I do not know whether that figure includes the state pension—Members of all parties, with the exception of the shadow Chancellor, support the triple lock—or the many welfare payments for families with someone in work. We are trying to reduce the need to support working families with welfare payments, through increases to the national living wage and steps to boost productivity. I would say that that figure is a misrepresentation—not that I would accuse the right hon. Member for Gainsborough of misrepresenting the facts—because it uses the word “welfare” as a catch-all, when many people who receive support from the state need that support and benefit from it in a reasonable way, including those who lose their jobs, whom we support through jobseeker’s allowance, for example.