Lord Jackson of Peterborough (Con)

My Lords, I shall touch briefly on two points prompted by both the noble Baroness, Lady Finlay of Llandaff, and my noble friend Lord Blencathra. In a sense they are a challenge to the sponsor, the noble and learned Lord. I think I am right in saying that he was a lot more definitive in his language in the Committee proceedings last week on 13 March about the need for the independent advocate to be present during discussions with the individual seeking to access the service. His Amendment 549A is more opaque in its language and does not specify that. Given the discussions that we had, particularly last week, about the power imbalance between someone who is less confident, less well-educated—a power imbalance between the decision-maker and the person accessing the service—it is an imperative that the independent advocate attends and is present to challenge some of the assumptions or decisions that are being made. I want also to consolidate a point raised by my noble friend about training. The noble and learned Lord will know, as he and others have lauded the system in Victoria, Australia, that the training provided around the specific issue of coercion is very limited at tier 1. He has potentially missed an opportunity to focus in on training. If you had an in-person independent advocate and poor training, that would not be great, but you would at least have someone attending. Instead, you have a situation of inadequate training and someone not attending in person. It may be that they can send an email, or do a report, or a telephone call, but that is not the same as being there advocating for that individual. I invite the noble and learned Lord, the sponsor, to address those specific issues of the opacity of his new amendment. I accept that it has been offered to the Committee in good faith to address some of the concerns and issues raised previously, but there is a specific issue about the wording of his new Amendment 549A and a specific issue of training around coercion, which is very important in this respect.