Lord Moylan (Con)

My Lords, I will speak to my Amendments 125 and 134 in this group. I am grateful to the noble Baroness, Lady Fox of Buckley, for the support that she has indicated for them. On the speech just made by the noble Baroness, Lady Walmsley, I am obviously distressed that she has been exposed needlessly to the sight of shiny vapes in her local supermarket, petrol station or whatever it is. We can sympathise with her on that, but she seems to have ignored entirely the context of Clause 89. This gives the Government the most extensive powers, at least in relation to packaging, which, as far as I can see, could very easily lead to the equivalent of plain packaging, but she made no reference to it. My amendments would increase the powers that the Government have in Clause 89. I will first explain the rationale for what I am proposing. There is a great deal of agreement—there has been throughout Report—between the Minister and me; I hope that we can continue that in the course of this debate. We agree, crucially, on the importance of how the flavours are described and presented to the public in attracting buyers to vapes. However, that cuts two ways. We know, on the one hand, that vapes can have what I call “flavour descriptors” on them. These are deliberately designed to appeal to children and young people in a way that we are all opposed to. We do not wish to see vapes marketed in such a way as to seduce children and young people into taking them up. When we see flavour descriptors such as “cotton candy” and “gummy bear” on the side of a vape, we can all agree that that sort of thing should have a stop put to it because we know the market that it is intended to reach. On the other hand, as I think the Minister has acknowledged, for vapes to be an effective cessation tool for adults it is important to have a range of flavours available to them. As I said, I think the Government have acknowledged that. Where in the Bill is the power that the Government need to regulate flavour descriptors? It is the flavour descriptor—the “gummy bear”, the “cotton candy”—that the Government need a clear power to be able to eliminate. We discussed this in Committee. The Minister very kindly wrote to me afterwards and said that the Government would rely on Clause 89, which relates to retail packaging. This gives the Government a certain number of powers to make regulations concerning packaging, but it does not at any point, as far as I can see, specify the flavour descriptor that appears on the packaging as something that the Government have a direct power to regulate. The Government may rely on Clause 89, and it may be possible that its scope could be stretched to cover their point. It would ultimately, I suppose, be a matter for the courts to decide. My Amendment 125, fairly straightforwardly, would give the Government that power explicitly. It would add to the list in Clause 89(3), currently running from paragraph (a) to paragraph (k), of the things that the Government can regulate. It would add a further thing: the flavour descriptor that appears on the packaging. I do not think the Government would necessarily want to reject this amendment. It would give them a power that could be very useful; even if they feel that they have this power already, making it explicit would make matters somewhat easier. To complement that, there is in Clause 91, which relates to contents and flavours, a power for the Government to make regulations concerning the “flavour of relevant products”. Here I want to make a point which I made in Committee and which is of the utmost importance; I speak as somebody who uses vapes. My point is that, in practice—I say this especially for the benefit of noble Lords who do not use vapes—the flavour descriptor on the vape has almost no relationship to the flavour of the vape.