Lord Moynihan (Con)

My Lords, I disagree with the Minister on one thing: I think this was a valuable debate. I thought that contributions from every Member of your Lordships’ House have been helpful and constructive. I do not think it has been, to quote him, “a waste of time”. I do not think anybody who spoke this evening wasted anybody’s time. There is cross-party recognition of the importance of addressing these issues, addressing the carbon order and addressing climate change. The question before us this evening is about the Carbon Budget Order 2026. The Minister is completely right to say that we should address this in the context of the impact assessment, which he considers to show us the truth. He is completely right to have identified that importance. Everything in my speech related to that—everything. I say to my noble friend Lord Deben that the public and our grandchildren will never forgive us if we destroy our economy with high energy prices. That is a real concern across this Chamber. We currently have electricity prices that are four times higher than the United States. That is the issue that we need to address. The impact assessment shows us that prices will go even higher if we follow these measures. I say to the noble Lord, Lord Hunt, that we share this factor: neither of us is obsessed with anything. There is no obsession on this side of the House, but there is real concern. There is cross-party concern with what is being proposed. Tony Blair has said that the net-zero policies that are being pushed forward are viewed as “unaffordable, ineffective, or politically toxic”. Gary Smith of the GMB, who is absolutely all over these issues, has recently said that the policies being pursued by the Government are “economic madness”. Even the Unite the Union says “No ban without a plan”. These points are worthy of consideration, because the North Sea issue is very important. I know everybody may have been distracted by Makerfield, but an important referendum was in effect being undertaken in the constituency of Aberdeen South, which was overwhelmingly won by the Conservative candidate. It was an overwhelming rejection of both the measures that are in this climate change Carbon Budget Order and the current Government’s policy on the North Sea, which is referred to. In closing, it is important for all of us to recognise that there is a universal position across this House that we have to get policy right. I do not think this order does. We cannot afford to damage our economy irreparably through a zealotry on net zero that goes too fast, too far, too early, and jeopardises our economic recovery and the key underlying policy of the Government, with which we agree—economic growth. The impact assessment is fundamentally flawed, not least on the important point about CCS, which, interestingly enough, is one point that was criticised by my noble friend Lord Deben. It is one of the three fundamental pillars on which the whole of this is based. With those concluding comments, and with my gratitude to everybody who has contributed to this valuable debate, I seek to test the will of the House.