Lord Lilley (Con)

My Lords, I am grateful to the noble Lord, Lord Dodds, for securing this debate and ensuring that we have three whole minutes to discuss the dismemberment of the United Kingdom. I began by trying to find out what this was about by reading the Explanatory Memorandum. I want to make a complaint to those who write these things—if any of them are listening. It is completely opaque. It gives no indication of the actual consequences of what we are doing on real people and real lives, or on the constitution of this country. In future, I hope they write them more informatively. Following from that, if we were to reject this statutory instrument, what would happen? Would it mean that European laws no longer applied in Northern Ireland? No, they would still apply. They would probably not be enforced by the British Government. I do not know what would happen. Perhaps the European Union would send in officials to do the enforcement for us. We should find out what the actual consequences are of passing or not passing this legislation before we decide whether it should go ahead. Next, do these regulations actually fulfil the promises of the Windsor Framework, as it is so called? I looked up what the promises were. It was said, re plant health and so on: “Instead of full EU certification, all plants and seeds will move under the existing UK-wide plant passport scheme, in line with traders throughout the UK”, and: “Previously banned seed potatoes will once again be available from other parts of the UK while remaining prohibited in Ireland”. Is that the case? Is it exactly the same as in the rest of the UK or not? The honourable Member in the other place, Sammy Wilson, said that he finds it difficult to get seed potatoes in Northern Ireland, that consignments above 2 kilograms have to go through complex procedures, and that lots of producers and suppliers no longer get them from GB. Is that or is that not the case? Will these regulations alter that in any way? I share the disgust which the noble Lord, Lord Dodds, mentioned at the inclusion in this document of statements that Northern Ireland is to be treated as part of the EU. What that is saying, in effect, is that the constitutional relationship between Northern Ireland and the rest of the United Kingdom is to be the same as between Donbass and Luhansk, and the rest of Ukraine. Legally, they are part of Ukraine, but the laws are made by Russia. Here, legally, Northern Ireland is part of—