B

Baroness Chapman of Darlington (Lab)

Speaking in the House of Lords on 1 September 2025

Debate

Middle East

Contribution

I thank both noble Lords for their contributions. I thank particularly the noble Lord, Lord Callanan, for reminding us of the situation in Afghanistan. He is right about the plight of people there, and I expect we will make further comments on this in the next few days. As he asked me to do, I am very happy to redouble and never stop calling for the immediate release of those hostages, who should be returned today and who were so cruelly and barbarically removed from their families, as well as for the return, tragically, of the bodies of some of those who were taken. I met the hostage families and made them a promise that I would continue to do that. I am very happy to do so until the day that they are all home, where they belong. Hamas’s role should end. Hamas is a terrorist organisation. It should have no role in the future administration of Palestine. When we are asked our view on this and about why we are working with the Palestinian Authority, our view very strongly is that it is essential that there is a group of leaders able to administer and lead responsibly in a Palestinian state. If you do not believe that, you do not truly believe in the viability of a two-state solution, and this Government do believe in that. When it comes to aid, we have spent just over £200 million in the last period on aid. We will continue to do that. We made more announcements over the weekend of some specific commitments on maternity care. I remind noble Lords there are still 120 babies being born each day in Gaza. I cannot imagine the difficulty of giving birth in such circumstances, particularly without medical assistance, including anaesthetics. That is the situation we are in, and we will continue to provide aid for as long as that is necessary. The difficulty, as noble Lords understand, I think, is that there remain obstacles to getting aid to where it is so desperately needed. We continue to call for and encourage the movement of that aid. On the timing of the announcement on recognition, yes, that did happen once we had risen for Summer Recess, but it was an announcement not of recognition itself but of an intention to recognise in a certain situation at the end of September. So it was known that there would be opportunity for us to debate that. I regret that we have had to get to this position at all. I have stood here many times and said that recognition should be part of the peace process. I had hoped that recognition could take place in far more positive circumstances, as part of a negotiation, perhaps. That is not where we are; recognition is not taking place against that backdrop. We will make an announcement on the basis of international law if the time comes, as seems increasingly likely. But Hamas does not want a two-state solution. It is not going to want to listen to our conditions; it is not interested in peace; it is a terrorist organisation. Our recognition of that is something that I know the noble Lord shares, so it seems a little odd to ask us why we are not having some sort of dialogue with Hamas. On the source of data, I accept we do not have sufficient data to be able to make the kinds of assessments that we would want to in other circumstances. It is not good enough that we are relying on the information that we are; it should be better. But the ability to have more accurate information, to have third-party corroboration and to have journalists able to report is prevented by the decision of the Government of Israel. It leads us to rely on the information that I know the noble Lord finds so unsatisfactory. This could be remedied and I only wish that it could be. I echo what the noble Lord, Lord Purvis, said about the noble Lord, Lord Newby. It was good to hear him make those remarks, and obviously we wish him well in his new role, with his new look, I see, this evening. I am glad too that he talked about Sudan because, as he rightly says, that is by far the biggest humanitarian crisis on the planet at the moment and shows little sign of improvement. I was on the border there myself earlier this year, and the situation there and the accounts that we are hearing are desperate. We have taken the decision to protect our aid to Sudan and his suggestion that we should make some sort of statement as to our assessment of the current situation is very helpful. I will take that back. We have long said that we believe that we ought to recognise the state of Palestine. The noble Lord asked why it is happening now and about conditionality. As I say, we feel that if we do not do this now, the whole concept of a two-state solution becomes jeopardised, given the situation on the ground. I agree as well that the futility of these statements is becoming increasingly sickening and I only wish that there was more that we could do that would have an effect on the ground. I deeply regret that our words are not heeded or listened to sufficiently by the Government of Israel, but that does not mean that we do not use our voice when we can to say what we think is right, and that is what this Government intend to continue to do.

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